The way I learned it was, People from the far east are Asian. Things from the far east oriental. So you can have an oriental rug made by an Asian weaver. ;)
These are good words you share Mark. Discernment is hard work and some people don't want to do the work so they either comply or stubbornly refuse. I think both of those options are self-centered instead of others-centered.
Using someone's preferred pronouns doesn't bother me, as long as I can remember to do it. I'm forgetful, not antagonistic. Honestly, when I read 1984, what I came away with was a fear of "alternative facts" as Kellyanne Conway so famously said. We're living in a world where something can clearly take place in plain sight, and yet, there will still be deniers of basic facts.
Glad you are feeling better. I was wondering how you feel about the division in the Methodist Church. It is a difficult time for sure. ( I am sorry this is off subject, but did not see another way to contact you. I was in your class way back in 2012? at Ashland Seminary with Debbie Federico.) blessings
So many of the readers are not part of the UMC, so I don't address those matters directly, but since you asked . . .
I am very thankful for my years in the UMC. They have given me freedom to preach whatever I believe, even though I still believe in the Virgin Birth, the resurrection, and the salvific affects of the blood of Jesus. I've had freedom to hold to these traditional, orthodox beliefs, even though many pastors, leaders and UM seminaries have wandered off into the weeds. There's been that freedom. And the UMC has taken good care of me in many ways, including the bishops who disagreed with me on key issues.
But that same freedom is tearing us apart. I'll not repeat some of the worn out arguments that have been used for decades. But our lack of an anchor in the scriptures has opened the door to heresy. (You can read an article that I wrote about this for the local chapter of the WCA: https://wpawca.org/blog-posts/legislation-revelation-blog/ .)
Any time the body of Christ fractures, it is tragic. Absolutely tragic. I'm sure it grieves the heart of God. But I also believe it grieves his heart for his Church to buy into the trendy ideologies of the day which are increasingly based upon inner feelings and devoid of any revelation from God. There is no compromising with this heresy.
The specific heresy is not Christological. It is anthropological--that is, it is about who we are as humans created in the image of God.
If you remember me teaching about the pagan worldview at Ashland where there were no clear boundaries between humanity, deity, and nature. This is also mentioned in my book "Into the Light." Because these boundaries are permeable, there is continuity among the three. Instead of God being transcendent, he is more like the Force of Star Wars. It makes God part of the created world, rather than the transcendent One who created the world. That is where this slippery slope leads.
And so, when we are making disciples for Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world (as per the purpose statement of the UMC), if we don't have a solid understanding of a biblical worldview, we are setting youth and college students up for failure.
Therefore, it seems the best we can do is to split off and reclaim a traditional and orthodox view on ALL issues: Virgin Birth, deity of Christ, the atoning work on the cross, and a biblical understanding of who we are as created in the image of God. And this latter issue, of course, has profound influence on how we steward this amazing and powerful gift of sexuality.
So, yes, a lengthy reply. Feel free to copy and send to others if you like. And, if you find it helpful, check out the blog article mentioned above.
Thank you for your wonderful response. I went through the Methodist tract at Ashland, but couldn’t bring myself to seek a place in their pastorate because of the spiritual battle I was having concerning their convoluted theology. I feel that the understanding of the identity of God, the Father, Son and Spirit has been so bent and broken through their drift into secular theology, that we have been left with apostasy.
Since then, it has been a wandering in the desert. As well, my husband had a major stroke in 2016, so much of our life has been dictated by that event. We are currently with a very small country church in Deersville,OH with a godly pastor. Thank you Lord. Living in SC in the winter now. Just published a book as well - The H.S. - volume one of the Holy Spirit series. Futuristic and fiction - a teaching tool into His identity😊 May God bless you in your journey. Will purchase your book. Mine is available on my website Thehsbook.com
Actually, my previous article posted August 9th is about Trueman's work. See "Emerging from the Fog." I have not waded through them yet, but have read some of his articles in First Things. And I'm glad to see that you are writing! Fantastic!
It might interest you, if you ever feel led back into pastoral ministry, the check out the new denomination being formed as a result of the UMC split. It's called the Global Methodist Church. Very tight theologically and very thoroughly Wesleyan.
Our local small church here in the Appalachian hills is planning to join the Global Methodist Church. Most in this area are as well. I have considered seeking credentials from them as well. We will see. Thank you for your ministry. For now, I will continue working on the book series and teaching about the Holy Spirit. (If you know of any women’s groups or others that would like to have a retreat or talk on this subject, let me know.).Blessings, Anne
The way I learned it was, People from the far east are Asian. Things from the far east oriental. So you can have an oriental rug made by an Asian weaver. ;)
These are good words you share Mark. Discernment is hard work and some people don't want to do the work so they either comply or stubbornly refuse. I think both of those options are self-centered instead of others-centered.
Thanks, brother.
Using someone's preferred pronouns doesn't bother me, as long as I can remember to do it. I'm forgetful, not antagonistic. Honestly, when I read 1984, what I came away with was a fear of "alternative facts" as Kellyanne Conway so famously said. We're living in a world where something can clearly take place in plain sight, and yet, there will still be deniers of basic facts.
So true.
Hello Dr. Ongly,
Glad you are feeling better. I was wondering how you feel about the division in the Methodist Church. It is a difficult time for sure. ( I am sorry this is off subject, but did not see another way to contact you. I was in your class way back in 2012? at Ashland Seminary with Debbie Federico.) blessings
Anne O’Planick
Hi Anne,
So many of the readers are not part of the UMC, so I don't address those matters directly, but since you asked . . .
I am very thankful for my years in the UMC. They have given me freedom to preach whatever I believe, even though I still believe in the Virgin Birth, the resurrection, and the salvific affects of the blood of Jesus. I've had freedom to hold to these traditional, orthodox beliefs, even though many pastors, leaders and UM seminaries have wandered off into the weeds. There's been that freedom. And the UMC has taken good care of me in many ways, including the bishops who disagreed with me on key issues.
But that same freedom is tearing us apart. I'll not repeat some of the worn out arguments that have been used for decades. But our lack of an anchor in the scriptures has opened the door to heresy. (You can read an article that I wrote about this for the local chapter of the WCA: https://wpawca.org/blog-posts/legislation-revelation-blog/ .)
Any time the body of Christ fractures, it is tragic. Absolutely tragic. I'm sure it grieves the heart of God. But I also believe it grieves his heart for his Church to buy into the trendy ideologies of the day which are increasingly based upon inner feelings and devoid of any revelation from God. There is no compromising with this heresy.
The specific heresy is not Christological. It is anthropological--that is, it is about who we are as humans created in the image of God.
If you remember me teaching about the pagan worldview at Ashland where there were no clear boundaries between humanity, deity, and nature. This is also mentioned in my book "Into the Light." Because these boundaries are permeable, there is continuity among the three. Instead of God being transcendent, he is more like the Force of Star Wars. It makes God part of the created world, rather than the transcendent One who created the world. That is where this slippery slope leads.
And so, when we are making disciples for Jesus Christ for the transformation of the world (as per the purpose statement of the UMC), if we don't have a solid understanding of a biblical worldview, we are setting youth and college students up for failure.
Therefore, it seems the best we can do is to split off and reclaim a traditional and orthodox view on ALL issues: Virgin Birth, deity of Christ, the atoning work on the cross, and a biblical understanding of who we are as created in the image of God. And this latter issue, of course, has profound influence on how we steward this amazing and powerful gift of sexuality.
So, yes, a lengthy reply. Feel free to copy and send to others if you like. And, if you find it helpful, check out the blog article mentioned above.
Peace to you, Anne!
Thank you for your wonderful response. I went through the Methodist tract at Ashland, but couldn’t bring myself to seek a place in their pastorate because of the spiritual battle I was having concerning their convoluted theology. I feel that the understanding of the identity of God, the Father, Son and Spirit has been so bent and broken through their drift into secular theology, that we have been left with apostasy.
Since then, it has been a wandering in the desert. As well, my husband had a major stroke in 2016, so much of our life has been dictated by that event. We are currently with a very small country church in Deersville,OH with a godly pastor. Thank you Lord. Living in SC in the winter now. Just published a book as well - The H.S. - volume one of the Holy Spirit series. Futuristic and fiction - a teaching tool into His identity😊 May God bless you in your journey. Will purchase your book. Mine is available on my website Thehsbook.com
Have you read Carl Trueman’s works?
Actually, my previous article posted August 9th is about Trueman's work. See "Emerging from the Fog." I have not waded through them yet, but have read some of his articles in First Things. And I'm glad to see that you are writing! Fantastic!
It might interest you, if you ever feel led back into pastoral ministry, the check out the new denomination being formed as a result of the UMC split. It's called the Global Methodist Church. Very tight theologically and very thoroughly Wesleyan.
Our local small church here in the Appalachian hills is planning to join the Global Methodist Church. Most in this area are as well. I have considered seeking credentials from them as well. We will see. Thank you for your ministry. For now, I will continue working on the book series and teaching about the Holy Spirit. (If you know of any women’s groups or others that would like to have a retreat or talk on this subject, let me know.).Blessings, Anne